Blackrock TBC crossrealm fiesta

[Vareesa]

Give this a chance. I know people think of Blackrock as "unfair advantage" automatically, but the aim is for the progression in this to be at around the same pace as Onyxia players, taking effort and time as well, just in a more PvP-focused manner. There is a plan to make that happen, but it can be adjusted and will if needed. We will be listening to feedback and open to change course if Blackrock characters get an edge at some point, as long as criticism is factual and presented in a mature way, and suggestions are realistic and reasonable.

Instead of all the doomsaying, save that energy to remind us this is still Onyxia and about Onyxia if and when something is going wrong in this attempt to make PvP even more active.

Sorry but why should we give it a chance, if we don't want it? Again, is it really that hard to respect our wishes? And sure, you could say "you don't like it, don't play here". Is that what Warmane stuff wants? To make us quit playing Onyxia? Because that is exactly what is going to happen, as many people mentioned here.
If you are talking about chances, then it should be the exact opposite. Give "chance" to Onyxia realm to play on it's own, and have us play with the Onyxia community only, same as up until now. You will see very easily that we don't need any "help" in order to keep active PvP environment.

If you say you will be listening to feedback, then why don't you now, when we say we don't want this cross-realm with Blackrock?

Maybe, but the fact remains that currently PvP has very little activity. Who knows, if Onyxia shows it can have plentiful and stable PvP activity on its own, maybe players could try asking for this cross-server to be severed.

Please, you can't compare current's PvP state with fresh TBC server. The PvP was very active during the first 6 months. But you play BG's (the only PvP currently on Onyxia) for 2 reasons only. For gear and for fun. Because of the HK system, everyone had the gear very quickly and everyone has rank14 gear for months now. So only fun remains and obviously people get bored of Vanilla BG's after playing them for year. If you had favorite food, eating it every day I am sure you would get sick of it after certain amount of time (much less than whole year).
You can't compare Onyxia now, where people are mostly raid logging, waiting for TBC which is about to release, knowing not only the current PvP gear is obsolete but as mentioned above, it is simply not fun anymore (pretty much the reason why expansions in WoW are needed, to bring new content, gear etc).
It will be the same in TBC by the way. Before every single phase release, the whole activity (not only PvP) fades, waiting for new content. Even more so before new expansion release, like now on Onyxia.

It would be pointless. We are fully aware the knee-jerk reaction would be to vote "no," even by people who won't ever touch PvP being asked to vote by friends. People haven't even experienced how it will work, so it would be a vote based on bias and "territorialism." Your best bet is what I said: show that Onyxia never needed the extra activity in the game.

You can't be serious about this. You just challenged the whole point of voting and democracy. You would not make a poll only based on assumption, that people with certain opinion would "force" others to vote the same and because of "territorialism"? Excuse me? Everyone can vote for themselves, there is no "territorialism" and most importantly, even if you told some friends to vote the same as you do, how would you make sure they did? The vote is anonymous. And why do you make assumptions that people who don't know how it works would vote a certain way? Actually, why do you even make assumption there are people who don't know how it works? See, this is exactly why this topic is so triggering. The arrogance, how you simply make us look stupid, that we don't know what is good for Onyxia, what is good for us. Now saying we can't even vote properly and objectively.
Also you focus way too much on "PvP" people in your response. As explained before, this will negatively impact PvE as well. Becuase it will make people quit + "transfer" to Blackrock. Not playing alts on Onyxia etc. Therefore leading to population decrease. And NOBODY on Onyxia wants smaller population. Whether it is PvP player or a person who never touched BG's and simply want to have fun farming dungeons, raids or whatever.

I agree with one point. And that is that the vote result would be NO. Not because of your arguments above, but simply because it is wrong and people are aware of it and don't want it to happen.

[verksm]

I didn't say anything about the "most competitive ones", just answered my guy believeing only Blackrock players would stomp less experienced players.
You do know there are competitive players that have played Vanilla on Onyxia and will also enjoy TBC as whole?

People will be more likely to play pvp alts on blackrock, but as many has stated this will have an effect on Onyxia as whole, in pve as well.

I've never stated that my guild threatened to quit, you must confuse me with someone else. Everyone in my guild are going to continue playing on Onyxia, both PvE and PvP.

"The main reason <rat> was created on Onyxia was to play TBC together. Up to now, everything we've done has been out of boredom and because our characters were locked with world buffs, due to Warmane’s decision to tune PvE content this way without offering a boon option.

After a year of building a community and progressing our characters toward TBC, if we're now going to face instant level 70 premade characters that can acquire hard-earned PvE items from a vendor then I can assure you, <rat> won’t be the only guild considering other places to spend their time.

If PvP queue times on Onyxia becomes an issue, make a change. This decision feels completely out of touch from what the majority of the Onyxia community wants and what the realm was originally meant to offer.

// Disappointed rats >:( "

Quick reminder :) but no I doubt there are any arena-only vanilla enjoyers in here as they tend to be quite different types of players.

However, as others have stated before there is always the possibility of shutting down Blackrock later on if it turns out to be a complete disaster or failure or if too many egos of Onyxia only players get hurt by having more competition but not testing it would be a mistake especially since the first season of TBC is considered a meme anyway.

[Sunite]

"The main reason <rat> was created on Onyxia was to play TBC together. Up to now, everything we've done has been out of boredom and because our characters were locked with world buffs, due to Warmane’s decision to tune PvE content this way without offering a boon option.

After a year of building a community and progressing our characters toward TBC, if we're now going to face instant level 70 premade characters that can acquire hard-earned PvE items from a vendor then I can assure you, <rat> won’t be the only guild considering other places to spend their time.

If PvP queue times on Onyxia becomes an issue, make a change. This decision feels completely out of touch from what the majority of the Onyxia community wants and what the realm was originally meant to offer.

// Disappointed rats >:( "

Quick reminder :) but no I doubt there are any arena-only vanilla enjoyers in here as they tend to be quite different types of players.

However, as others have stated before there is always the possibility of shutting down Blackrock later on if it turns out to be a complete disaster or failure or if too many egos of Onyxia only players get hurt by having more competition but not testing it would be a mistake especially since the first season of TBC is considered a meme anyway.

How about we test it other way first? Oh that wouldn't be by your terms and it would show that Onyxia wouldn't need PvP help which also don't suit you or am I wrong?

[Obnoxious]

Sorry but why should we give it a chance, if we don't want it?

Because the alternatives to giving it a chance is not doing PvP or *****ing about it in the Forum. Giving it a chance is just the more mature one.

If you say you will be listening to feedback, then why don't you now, when we say we don't want this cross-realm with Blackrock?

Because that isn't the feedback we will be listening to. I assumed that to not require saying.

Please, you can't compare current's PvP state with fresh TBC server. The PvP was very active during the first 6 months.

Then players will have no problem proving that there was no need for this initiative.

You can't be serious about this. You just challenged the whole point of voting and democracy.

This is a privately owned server, not your government or a democracy. Players might have feedback, but the decision is and always will be with the Administration. Don't be one of the "muh freedum o'speesh" dudes next.

Also you focus way too much on "PvP" people in your response. As explained before, this will negatively impact PvE as well. Becuase it will make people quit + "transfer" to Blackrock. Not playing alts on Onyxia etc. Therefore leading to population decrease. And NOBODY on Onyxia wants smaller population. Whether it is PvP player or a person who never touched BG's and simply want to have fun farming dungeons, raids or whatever.

If there are people who only want to focus on PvP and grinding for stuff with PvP, why should they be forced to feed your PvE groups in the first place? Yeah, awesome argument, "now people won't have to do stuff they don't want, but that I want them to do."

[KeRRiGaN68]

If there are people who only want to focus on PvP and grinding for stuff with PvP, why should they be forced to feed your PvE groups in the first place? Yeah, awesome argument, "now people won't have to do stuff they don't want, but that I want them to do."

they can play with other Blackrock players

[Blakeatron]

It would be pointless. We are fully aware the knee-jerk reaction would be to vote "no," even by people who won't ever touch PvP being asked to vote by friends. People haven't even experienced how it will work, so it would be a vote based on bias and "territorialism." Your best bet is what I said: show that Onyxia never needed the extra activity in the game.

Thank you for the extra context and insight for everyone, Obnoxious. It's great to know that you guys are well aware of this territorialism mindset that some (not all) of the people against this decision are using to back their opinions.

I still think some people in this thread are confused, which is probably a result of them not reading through any of the content and just responding to the subject line.

Blackrock TBC players will not get faster PvP gear than you on Onyxia. You have the same opportunity, if you want to put PvP as your focus, to get PvP gear at the same exact rate that Blackrock will. Blackrock isn't starting until days after Onyxia to make sure of that, which is another great decision by the devs.

People keep mentioning "what if my item doesn't drop, how is it fair that I can play versus someone that has it?" That is WoW. That's how WoW works. The goal is that at the end of the season, when pushing matters, the gear is balanced out and everyone is equal. You will ALSO be fighting people on Onyxia that have certain pieces that never dropped for you.

The devs have proven that they've put a lot of thought into this decision, even stating that they will continue to listen through the early seasons to make any adjustments needed. Stop dooming on the server, stop threatening to quit, stop responding to threads when you're not reading through for full context.

You'll get into Onyxia, have a blast, queue up for your fast popping BGs and high-variety arenas due to the player pools being large, and win/lose versus blackrock players you'll be mad at them for existing. You'll have a great TBC experience either way, and now more people get to play the game.

[Jedborg]

"The main reason <rat> was created on Onyxia was to play TBC together. Up to now, everything we've done has been out of boredom and because our characters were locked with world buffs, due to Warmane’s decision to tune PvE content this way without offering a boon option.

After a year of building a community and progressing our characters toward TBC, if we're now going to face instant level 70 premade characters that can acquire hard-earned PvE items from a vendor then I can assure you, <rat> won’t be the only guild considering other places to spend their time.

If PvP queue times on Onyxia becomes an issue, make a change. This decision feels completely out of touch from what the majority of the Onyxia community wants and what the realm was originally meant to offer.

// Disappointed rats >:( "

Quick reminder :) but no I doubt there are any arena-only vanilla enjoyers in here as they tend to be quite different types of players.

However, as others have stated before there is always the possibility of shutting down Blackrock later on if it turns out to be a complete disaster or failure or if too many egos of Onyxia only players get hurt by having more competition but not testing it would be a mistake especially since the first season of TBC is considered a meme anyway.

This was also said before Staff clarified the terms of the Blackrock realm, that Onyxia players will actually have a gear advantage because Blackrock TBC will not open at the same time as TBC releases. Also, there are more guilds more divided in this matter and will most likely move on because of this decision.
RAT has a lot of friends, both online and irl ones. But if this turns out to be a catastrophe for the Onyxia population it might have an effect on our guild as well.

The whole point of this thread is not about bashing the "pvp-only players" but that Onyxia community didn't have a voice in this at all.
If previous requested that "Onyxias and Blackrocks ladder/rewards will be separated if Onyxia's pvp scene is fine by its own" will be implemented then I personally think Onyxia will be as active and alive as we all wants it to be.

[Sunite]

Then players will have no problem proving that there was no need for this initiative.

How exactly if you WON'T even let us play first season on our own?

If there are people who only want to focus on PvP and grinding for stuff with PvP, why should they be forced to feed your PvE groups in the first place? Yeah, awesome argument, "now people won't have to do stuff they don't want, but that I want them to do."

Why should WE be FORCED to feed their PvP bracket explain this logic to me?

[Jedborg]

Anyways. We've got some insight on this whole situation at least.

Let's see how everything plays out once it's released!

*tbc hype*

[Butkus]

This has already been addressed, but we can do it again just for you.

Blackrock players will need to pay arena points for trinkets like this. So:

Onyxia player gets 4 piece season set from arena points while raiding every week. Chance of dropping and getting loot starting from first week of the season. Possible to have Zerker's call or other similar items week 1 in the season.

Blackrock player needs to buy 4 piece, never raids, then needs to save for additional time to buy the trinket. They'll get the trinket weeks into the seasons with no chance of getting it earlier.

It's variance vs no variance. Onyxia player can get lucky and get it weeks 1-3, or they can get unlucky and get it after. Blackrock player locked in on getting it several weeks into the season.

In the end where people are pushing for titles, everyone is the same and all is equal.

Onyxia has it better in this scenario in my opinion, but that's subjective.

so you are saying that blackrock players will get instant 70 and can buy any and all gear they want for honor and arena points from vendors? this includes pve trinket like berserkers call that drop from raids?

ever stop and think that players on onyxia might never see berserkers call drop do to rng/drop rates?
guilds gear players in an order.. usually GM first and their closest in games friends and so on...


yeah this gear thing is really going to a issue..

why play on onyxia? why spend gold leveling professions? and talents? why spend weeks/months doing raids hoping for certain items to drop when you can play black rock and buy all that gear from a vendor for honor and AP?


rating on gear?what about cheating? the cheating on onxyia is beyond bad and thats with bgs.. come arena lol even worse.

and this will all turn in wrath... and i dont play wrath.. glad im spending my "WOW TIME" else where


@warmane staff- you should really consider doing a classic V and classic TBC server/thing without wrath

[Obnoxious]

How exactly if you WON'T even let us play first season on our own?

Already answered.

Why should WE be FORCED to feed their PvP bracket explain this logic to me?

You aren't feeding their PvP bracket, it's the other way around.




Not aimed at you specifically, but I likely won't be replying further to posts that aren't really bringing up anything new or worth addressing individually.

[Sunite]

You aren't feeding their PvP bracket, it's the other way around.

Then surely they can live without cross realm and we will live with whatever we have left...But this was already confirmed by Blackrock players that they need us more then we need them simple as that.

But yeah this is going to nowhere no matter how many facts we present to you, you have already decided to bring on new players you can cash on, no matter how damaging it will be for current realm.

Can you or any staff at least confirm or deny ladder split?

[Butkus]

Crossrealm arenas between Onyxia and Blackrock is just going to be a ****show. This is a terrible idea and it gives a HUGE advantage to Blackrock players over Onyxia players ONLY if both players are on the same level.

Onyxia players will have to go through forming a raid - killing bosses - dropping the loot - getting the desired x loot. Meanwhile the same version of me on Blackrock who is on the same rating as me, can get that desired pve loot through arena points (which basically means my version on Blackrock has a 100% chance to get the item if they get enough arena points)

I wouldn't another version of me on Blackrock getting the desired loot through arena points while i have to sweat and pray for mine on Onyxia.

Like I said, this will only affect pvp players who are on the same level, a **** player on Blackrock will still get stomped by a good Onyxia player, doesn't matter what gear that Blackrock player has, and vise versa.

Keep Onyxia as it is, with its own player base, and you can keep Blackrock TBC to whoever wants to hop there and do some pvp against new players.

I really hope you get the point.

"Onyxia players will have to go through forming a raid - killing bosses - dropping the loot - getting the desired x loot. Meanwhile the same version of me on Blackrock who is on the same rating as me, can get that desired pve loot through arena points (which basically means my version on Blackrock has a 100% chance to get the item if they get enough arena points)"

if thats true?and its what i have been asking about..

so players on black rock can "cap out" in arena say 5v5.. on crappy arena teams and just save arena points "and get extra points do to shorter pvp seasons"..

and buy any and all gear they want including pve gear from raids for honor and arena points? professions.. rep based rewards..

while players on onxyia have to level put time into grinding and raiding and gearing along with rep and attuments sopend gold to gear gem and enchant.. then have to raid see items drop and win said items... with rng...

what happens if say a player on onyxia misses a week or arena for what ever reason.. like no teams or is busy running raids?miss a flush one week and how far behind is said player now?

what happens if players on onyxia dont have raid spots...and have to pug... black rock players dont have to deal with that as they buy gear from a vendor?

is this a joke?

[verksm]

Also since we already had this situation with an instant realm releasing alongside a progressive one including linked pvp brackets back then people seemed to be a lot more chill about it but the people posting here some to be incredibly upset and threatened by this which is just surreal to me. I wonder how many of you guys are even actively going to play arena sessions or if you are just posting for reactions or drama.

[PorkBacon]

the difference from here and frostmourne is that we didnt have this from the start on onyxia, so dont compare apples to oranges. Doesnt matter how much or little we will play pvp, the fact that we are at some point makes this extremely relevant.